Veg
Randall's Friend (800-1999)
Posts: 1,550
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Post by Veg on Jun 24, 2005 23:22:03 GMT -5
Me and my sister were watching some fireworks a few weeks ago at the end of the annual carnival, and my sister pointed out that one of the fireworks looked like Mike Wazowski. I pointed out how cool it would be if they did a Randall firework at Disneyland. She gave me one look and said, ¨They only do hero´s at Disneyland.¨ IS SHE SAYING RANDALL ISN´T A HERO?!! What´s wrong with her?
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Post by lizardgirl on Jun 25, 2005 9:44:26 GMT -5
Well, I guess it depends on the definition of 'hero'. Mike and Sulley certainly are NOT heroes, no matter what people say, because although they stopped Waternoose, their punishment for Randall was completely innapropriate, so if they WERE 'heroes', they would've done the right thing- not what they did.
Randall also made a lot of mistakes and was involved with a lot of wrong-doing, but he had his reasons for doing so, and if Mike and Sulley had been in the same situation as Randall had been, it'd be surprising how similar their situations would've ended up as.
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Post by pitbulllady on Jun 25, 2005 11:08:28 GMT -5
I wouldn't consider Randall to be a "hero", based on the events of the movie, but that doesn't make him a "villain", either. He's just an ordinary person, like most of us are. I DEFINATELY don't consider Mike or Sulley to be heroes! Heroes do not act out of revenge, or plan to abandon children in the forest(Mike's idea). Heroes aren't cowardly. Nothing about them warrents the title of "hero". Like LGBB said, if the proverbial shoes had been on THEIR feet, they would likely have acted in ways very much like Randall's.
pitbulllady
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Post by lizardgirl on Jun 26, 2005 9:38:08 GMT -5
Yep. In some ways, if you consider Boo to be the innocent party, Mike and Sulley were almost villains!
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Post by RandallBoggs on Jun 26, 2005 10:53:11 GMT -5
Well actually. You COULD consider Randall a neutral at the beginning and middle, but a hero at the end. It's true. You can call him a hero if you want. I mean, SULLIVAN let the kid into the world, SULLIVAN caused all the havoc and panic.....Randall didn't want that and wanted to end that. And at the end, he wanted to get Boo back to her door to stopped everything that was going on, hence, stopping the panic and saving Monstropolis. Of course....Sullivan and Wazowski were doing some-what the same....
Randall also, even though he wasn't on the same terms as Waternoose, took part in TRYING to save Monstropolis's energy problems.
So yeah...he could be considered a hero if you look at it right.
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Post by pitbulllady on Jun 26, 2005 11:05:21 GMT -5
Well actually. You COULD consider Randall a neutral at the beginning and middle, but a hero at the end. It's true. You can call him a hero if you want. I mean, SULLIVAN let the kid into the world, SULLIVAN caused all the havoc and panic.....Randall didn't want that and wanted to end that. And at the end, he wanted to get Boo back to her door to stopped everything that was going on, hence, stopping the panic and saving Monstropolis. Of course....Sullivan and Wazowski were doing some-what the same.... Randall also, even though he wasn't on the same terms as Waternoose, took part in TRYING to save Monstropolis's energy problems. So yeah...he could be considered a hero if you look at it right. Well, yeah... I guess you could, looking at it that way. Randall WAS trying to accomplish something for the good of his own people and city, and he HAD had to make some pretty big sacrifices in doing so, to the point of endangering his own health and well-being, BUT it was not HIS idea to do so in the first place. He was more or less forced to do it, by someone else, and had little real say-so or choice in the matter. That part negates the whole "hero" aspect. pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Jun 26, 2005 11:09:50 GMT -5
Well not exactly. He was forced to do it, but he DID like the thought that he was going to be helping others.....and essentially Randall does like helping people....and that is the quality of a hero is it not?
Hmm....thinking on another term of "hero". Who remembers Odysseus? Pitbulllady? It was either Greek or Roman or something that defined Hero by three aspects. One being that he "represents people as a whole (which Randall does since he represent most people who have rought lives)" or something like that and two others...
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Post by lizardgirl on Jun 26, 2005 12:46:18 GMT -5
Yeah, I guess that's true.
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Post by RandallBoggs on Jun 26, 2005 12:53:18 GMT -5
See...I'm right... Randall could be consider a hero...
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Post by lizardgirl on Jun 26, 2005 12:59:50 GMT -5
No, I was agreeing with pitbulllady- that, technically, although some of Randall's intentions were right, he isn't really a hero.
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Post by RandallBoggs on Jun 26, 2005 13:01:50 GMT -5
How would you define hero Cool? In my definition, Randall is a hero. He intented to help people by his own thoughts. He didn't want to hurt anyone.
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Post by lizardgirl on Jun 26, 2005 13:10:44 GMT -5
But did he help people? If someone was a hero because of what they intended, then a lot of people could be heroes. It's what they DO that counts.
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Post by RandallBoggs on Jun 26, 2005 13:15:11 GMT -5
No Cool. If you even consider trying to do actions your a hero. It's the decisions you make, not the end result. Its what you did to get there, not what you fully accomplished. Randall worked his hardest on that machine, partly FOR what he it was going to do. End the "scream shortage" as well as help the city and other cities in the world.
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Post by pitbulllady on Jun 26, 2005 13:56:21 GMT -5
A hero not only represents ALL people, but is someone who is willing to selflessly give of themselves for others' benefits, even to the point of risking or losing their own life, just to help others, without ANY thought as to what's in it for them, and without being told to do so. By that definition, I cannot define Randall as a "hero", since he was NOT doing this on his own, and he DID expect, obviously, to get something in return if he was successful. I don't think, that while he was putting a great deal of personal sacrafice, in terms of time, labor, health, etc, into building the Scream Extractor, that he would have willingly risked all that, or his life even, unless someone was forcing him to do so, nor would he have done all this unless he expected to get something really good as payment for his efforts. That's why he tells Wazowski that "soon, even the 'Great James P. Sullivan' will be working for ME". Randall had obviously been promised an executive position within the company to sweeten the deal and offset any threats and put-downs made by his boss. Yes, he believed he was doing good for all, BUT it was not entirely selfless, if he was doing it under pressure or with the belief that he'd be rewarded with something tangible, like a payraise and a position of importance.
I think a lot of people nowadays have no clue what a hero is, and, like Buddy, are convinced that a hero is merely someone you admire or look up to, or who is well-liked by the public. Believe me, there are LOTS of people who are well-liked by the public, who are flashy and put on a show, and admired by many for whatever reasons, who are anything BUT heroes! I would consider Steve Buscemi to be a rare hero among celebs, due to his work at the World Trade Center site. He stood to gain absolutely nothing from doing that, except the knowledge of knowing that he'd help some family find whatever semblence of closure they could from having their loved one's remains found. He put his very life in grave danger every second he was on that site, and I can only imagine the sort of grueling, frustrating work it must have been, but he was COMPELLED to do that, not because someone told him to do it. He'd left the dangerous work of firefighting to become an actor, but like Bob Parr, he HAD to do something like this to help people, many of whom he never met, who wouldn't have known him from Adam's housecat. That's what I would consider a hero, folks.
pitbulllady
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Post by pitbulllady on Jun 26, 2005 14:02:26 GMT -5
No Cool. If you even consider trying to do actions your a hero. It's the decisions you make, not the end result. Its what you did to get there, not what you fully accomplished. Randall worked his hardest on that machine, partly FOR what he it was going to do. End the "scream shortage" as well as help the city and other cities in the world. No, Sean, "considering" doing something does NOT make you a hero, by any circumstances whatsoever! If that were the case, ALL of us would be heros, and(to make an "Incredibles" analogy again) if ALL of us were heroes, NO ONE would be, since a hero is someone who stands out by their ACTIONS. ALL of us THINK about doing things for other people, expecting nothing in return, but how many of us actually DO them? I help people as part of my job, but if my paycheck were taken away, I'd quit in an instant! If it got to the point where my life was in danger or my health was severely threatened, I'd quit. Sure, I've heard of situations where I thought, "oh, if *I* had been there, I'd have yada yada yada...", but the truth is, I don't KNOW what I'd have done. Often a person becomes a hero unexpectedly, by doing something spur-of-the-moment, without thinking about it. Sitting around THINKING about what you'd do does not make you a hero anymore than thinking about cooking makes you a master chef. pitbulllady
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