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Post by mentalguru on Oct 3, 2009 5:45:32 GMT -5
I don't know... if Waternoose knew she was human wouldn't he tell Randall?
Of course, it's possible he could SUSPECT it, and not know for sure. But he knows Sulley has to come 'see him' later on that day anyway (for the scare demo), so perhaps, without looking TOO suspicious he can further observe her if necessary.
(I mean come on, how FAKE was that "Ah! The child!" Either Randall told him on some comm link about what happened with Mike or he had his suspicions at least all along).
It's also possible when he said 'one of yours' he might have meant even a niece or the child of a cousin (and Sulley does do this 'cousin's sister's daughter.... so you mean your COUSIN'S daughter right Sulley? Oh Sulley, I love you but you're such an IDIOT sometimes. XD.).
Yeah, I think Sulley's family might be BIG enough for it be easy enough for that to sound plausible. Plus, yup, it's pretty likely they are old fashioned on some level.
What about MIKE'S family? Dinogirl raises an interesting point- I do see Mike as an only child myself. His mother is doting (I mean come on he's a grown man... and she's coming and cheering is company play like she's a mother during a SCHOOL play. Or something. )
Granted this play also provides evidence that Mike and Sulley are far from their home towns- they've known eachother from grade school, which we hear earlier in the movie ("...Jealous of my good looks from the fourth grade pal!" -In your dreams maybe Wasoski. lol-) But we also hear Mike yelling how his mum has come 'all the way' to Monstropolis.
So Mike and Sulley are at least some considerable distance from their old homes. Perhaps they used to be closer before they moved and decided to get into scaring. This could increase Sulley's likelihood of latching onto a father figure- Waternoose if he hasn't been that far a way before. Old fashioned families DO tend to more keep into the same town as each other then travel too far away.
Company Play theory: The people watching the play think most of the story is fiction, they just maybe used a modern day event or fiasco (Boo getting in) and simply based their plot on it. People in OUR world do this all the time after all. Perhaps the odd person finds the idea of using a guy as the 'bad guy' someone techincally 'missing' at this point as a bit tasteless, but that's about it, they don't think much about it. Also we really don't see a 'banishment scene' in the play either. It's likely they were creative with the facts (I mean come on, Mike made out he was some sort of fearless hero in it.)
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Post by mentalguru on Oct 3, 2009 6:15:51 GMT -5
Sorry, feel like I must explain the 'company play theory' thing further. We don't know the 'official story' that the Monster World has been told. Perhaps the 'official story' is that Sulley and Mike only saw the kid briefly and saw her laugh- the energy spikes etc, and that's where they eventually got the idea about using laughter. We also do not see a scene where Sulley lets Boo in. The play... mmm, whose idea was it? Perhaps Mike's, after someone asked about it maybe. Possibly Sulley feels a bit better, from the possibilities of him having that guilt but he still hasn't 'caught on' to what it really is- since this play is at least a bit closer to the truth, but it's not completely. Plus the 'play' could be actually set BEFORE Sulley is reunited with Boo, so he could also be still attributing any bad feelings to simply missing her rather than anything else. Sulley seems awkward in the beginning. Of course that could be basic stage fright. (Sure, Sulley likes the attention on the scare floor, but I'm a tour guide* part time, during holidays at home anyway, and I've been on stage. Trust me, although there is sometimes nerves with the former, the latter is more terrifying.) *Technically when kids are around I sort of almost have to do the job of a scarer and a 'laughter collector' at the same time - I have to keep the kids entertained and make them laugh with all the 'yucky' parts of history. Also scare the little blighters senseless in the haunted bedroom with the ghost story. But of course, I try to scare adults and make them laugh too with that. Heh, it's fun. Of course it depends on who you get.
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Post by RandallBoggs on Oct 3, 2009 18:51:01 GMT -5
*waves hand* Waternoose is OLD...very old...he took over the factory at over a hundred years old...who knows how long he's had the factory. Up until then maybe he WAS a good friend with Sullivan's dad. But not the whole "close close" thing, that's not what I mean. Sorta like "Oh yeah, he was my roommate...good guy" sort of thing. Of course the entails to whether Waternoose himself had a child or not is something else.
Well it is true that behemoths are a rather big family entirely...and given the mere number of Monster Species, knowing if someone was related to someone else may actually be allot more difficult. Waternoose himself may still be hung on "old traditions" given the fact he probably grew up in...lets see...from the 1900s on. ---------------- Of course Monsters Inc. has a Daycare (of which Randall himself makes a point to avoid ^0^), so perhaps Waternoose asked that in that way to see if Ms. Nesbit was doing her job. But yeah, he probably didn't mean it was Sllivan's. I'm unsure about perception of Boo's costume....I mean we never got to see if it would fool Randall, which I doubt. As for Waternoose...he may have not cared to look for a time, as he was busy trying to tend to the C.D.A. swarming his factory. ------------------- Which is another reason why I think Waternoose didn't know. If he did, certainly he would have tried something there, and certainly would have been less than friendly when Sullivan came into the training room. Heck, Waternoose may not have even been there if he knew. That invitation for a scare demo was interesting too...despite the fact that, yes, new scarers need a demostration...something just seemed...off. Whether Randall told or not is debatable. Perhaps he did. But then again he might have put it off until he knew better (at the risk of getting "a talk" from Waternoose himself, which he got later") Sullivan is a bit dim sometimes, but just sometimes heh. I have some theories Wazowski might have had two parents, though is morely in contact with his mom more. He does have a cousin if I recall...so think that means he has a sibling. ------------------------ One thing to take into a count is...Wazowski's selfish...he's indulgent of himself, and thinks himself all the better. So no matter what, he'll be in nearly every scene (or every scene) and always form it in some way that he's the better in it all.
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randomdrifter
Randall's Skivvy (0-299)
Humility and Strength have never looked better.
Posts: 142
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Post by randomdrifter on Oct 4, 2009 3:27:11 GMT -5
Going back to why female scarers seem to be scarce.
Scaring is probably a male dominated field in their world. It’s a physically demanding job that seems to favor brawn and physical characteristics that, to humans and monsters alike, are intimidating, such as height, fangs, claws, and probably even weight. Also, do you notice how the Scarers express some level of aggression while on the job? In our culture and certainly theirs, aggression seems to be exclusive to males (or at least perceived as more acceptable and expected than female aggression) and probably encouraged or fostered in some way during training to successfully frighten the daylights out of little children. Based on what we’ve seen in the movie, I think female beauty ideals on a physical and behavioral level are pretty much like our own--women are slender, feminine, nurturing, and less aggressive. I’m not implying that this is generally how all women are or that there have never been female scarers, but I still believe that the nature of the job itself and cultural norms are the reason why women are likely the minority in the field. That’s one theory.
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Post by pitbulllady on Oct 4, 2009 5:20:13 GMT -5
Going back to why female scarers seem to be scarce. Scaring is probably a male dominated field in their world. It’s a physically demanding job that seems to favor brawn and physical characteristics that, to humans and monsters alike, are intimidating, such as height, fangs, claws, and probably even weight. Also, do you notice how the Scarers express some level of aggression while on the job? In our culture and certainly theirs, aggression seems to be exclusive to males (or at least perceived as more acceptable and expected than female aggression) and probably encouraged or fostered in some way during training to successfully frighten the daylights out of little children. Based on what we’ve seen in the movie, I think female beauty ideals on a physical and behavioral level are pretty much like our own--women are slender, feminine, nurturing, and less aggressive. I’m not implying that this is generally how all women are or that there have never been female scarers, but I still believe that the nature of the job itself and cultural norms are the reason why women are likely the minority in the field. That’s one theory. It's like why there are no female NASCAR drivers at the present; there have been a few who tried it, and Dannica Patrick is training for the move from Indy racing to NASCAR now, but it's still, and probably always will be, a male-dominated career/sport. pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Oct 4, 2009 18:42:42 GMT -5
If I had to guess that what "time" the Monster World is in...I would think that they've recentlly gotten over a Martin Luther King stage...though there's still tension...and that the start of women's rights may have started. But in all honesty, I doubt there aren't any female scarers.
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Post by pitbulllady on Oct 4, 2009 21:08:45 GMT -5
Like you said earlier, RB, there are over 1,000 Scarers employed by the factory, working several different Scare Floors, so it's really implausible that at least SOME of those floors don't have female Scarers. Besides, some of the ones we saw in the background on Randall's Scare Floor could have been female, but since it's sorta hard to tell when it comes to other species, and because we never hear those "background" Scarers talk or hear anyone address them by name, we don't know if they're male or female.
pitbulllady
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randomdrifter
Randall's Skivvy (0-299)
Humility and Strength have never looked better.
Posts: 142
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Post by randomdrifter on Oct 4, 2009 21:12:10 GMT -5
I think it was mentalguru who mentioned that the monster world was sort of like an Earth B, and I agree with that view given how there doesn't seem to be any open discrimination against minorities, including women. They're probably right where we are as far as civil rights are concerned.
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Post by mentalguru on Oct 5, 2009 4:38:54 GMT -5
All interesting points about female scarers. It seems as if, other than a few who like the 'weight gain' (but they exist HERE too of course, they're called 'chubby chasers', in Britain anyway- they like BIG men/women), that for the most part, what is attractive for females to be HERE which is held by many people, there's some correlation with what monsters also probably seem to find attractive in women (physically anyway)- you know certain... feminine 'shapes' which are a bit like what attractive human females tend to have. In terms of pure physical attractiveness that is. Of course, is this speculation? I think Celia is attractive myself, but is she to monsters themselves? Mike is probably a bit shallow, so I could see her actually being seen as attractive by other monsters too. Of course, I actually found her attractive when she was yelling at Mike. But I'm just weird. Plus two of the four female monsters (the ones we know of) wearclothes- for males it seems to be only Waternoose. And Sulley wears a tie in the end. Me thinks there might be some anatomy 'issues' with those SPECIFIC female monsters sometimes or maybe it's because the ones we see tend to work in an office so it looks better? Clothes seem to be a status symbol on some level. Betty seems to be an exception to females wearing clothes as well as Marge. It possibly depends on the monster but perhaps some monsters DO actually 'need' to wear clothes, and in most cases, they tend to be women. But don't monsters get cold? I mean Sulley has his fur, so does George, but not all of them have this benefit. -- Thing is RB- Waternoose COULD be friends with Sulley's dad, or was at one point, but we don't really KNOW. I like the idea Sulley's dad was a scarer though (but it isn't a canon fact either), and that Sulley either moved into scaring in his recently deceased father's memory, or that he decided to go into it being unhappy with his old job on his father's advice. Or an odd combination of the two even (like his father passing away soon after giving the advice or during the training... now there's a one-shot plot bunny.)
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Post by RandallBoggs on Oct 5, 2009 20:52:18 GMT -5
"Junk Trunk" tehehe ^0^ I'm sorry people, but it's just a term some use 0_0 Think clothes may just be an option...sometimes probably used to just "touch up the look".
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Post by mentalguru on Oct 6, 2009 8:31:44 GMT -5
Another idea is 'Randall doesn't drink'- it's something I put into my story, but to be honest it wasn't my original idea, at the time I thought it was a canon fact I didn't have access to (I just recently got the special 2 disc edition online at Amazon... YAY! Still have to watch all the extras though.) I more or less saw this picture of Randall on DevArt and a commenter mentioned that Randall didn't drink. I'm still unaware of whether it is really canon or not. But I like the idea, so I put it away for later. The question is, why wouldn't he drink? That was what I wondered, so I tried to insert it into the story. Possibility is that he has had a bad experience with it. A part of me wondered if it figured into how Randall was eventually convinced into building the scream extractor perhaps. A part of me thinks Randall would also be an incredible lightweight when it comes to alcohol. It just fits how I view him perhaps. Waternoose however is a a harder drinker- he can really hold his drink compared to Randall, someone who, even before then might not have drank THAT much and is quite a bit younger. (He probably had some expieriences as a teen due to his desperate need for popularity but not alot probably esp. not compared to his boss!). Waternoose strikes me as someone who has the bottle underneath his desk if you get me. I don't like Waternoose, but CEO is hardly an EASY job (if you are taken seriously...*) I could see Randall, being the top scarer at the time, perhaps Sulley's training just about to be finished having a chat with Waternoose in his office at some stage. Over praise and various strokes to his ego as well as some alcohol in his system, Randall would be incredibly malleable IMO. It lowers his inhibitions even further. Alcohol doesn't even necessarily have to play a part in it at ALL of course. But it's possible. And if the idea Randall doesn't drink is true, it could explain some things. I'd like to write a one-shot like that anyway. . It does kind of fit in also with how PBL said was a bit like a 'molestor' you know lulling the victim's into a false sense of security....Granted, once again, alcohol is probably not completely necessary, but it would make for a good story. Because he has to go out less with his extra work load, Randall doesn't 'get out' to drink anyway that much, and when things eventually start sour with Waternoose, he eventually resents the fact that the drink perhaps played a part in him getting into this mess. So he pretty much vows he'll never touch it again anyway. *Another thing- I don't think Sulley is taken seriously by the board as CEO at first, as mentioned in another thread, the board might see him as a 'mascot' to upkeep their family image, and perhaps make all the decisions themselves. They 'keep his busy' with some things in the beginning perhaps. Other theory: Ignoring the numbers, Randall with probably more creative methods of scaring, takes longer than Sulley perhaps to get through each door but has less doors shredded per annum (he keeps each individual kid scared at him for longer). One of Mike's New Year's resolutions was that he wouldn't forget his paperwork. He clearly failed in this case. Some of the time, Mike just leaves it behind and Sulley isn't even aware of this, but he HAS done it for him before, but it's been a while, so that's why he has trouble remembering all the different places it seems to go. Plus, they may have changed things around a bit perhaps too, adding a new 'sections' and bizarre colours because paperwork seems to be one huge conspiracy. (I am SO glad I'm not officially in the office place where I tour guide on the hols, but I've had to help out with it a few times, and it is rediculous the amount they have to do. Usually if tour guides do get 'roped in' everyone wants to do the phones because it is less boring, tedious or confusing. Even though I hate answering phones usually. Nobody likes paperwork. And after some time you never remember the 'rules' told to you months ago because, well, it's been a while since you've done it so you wonder if you are being more of a hinderance then a help . Plus, sometimes the rules just seem to change as mentioned. Because the people who make all these rules suck. (This scene once happened to me, more or less paraphrased)- Me: *Has filled in forms and hands them to person in charge* "That's great, thanks. Wait... this is the wrong property code and colour! It's one of the older forms, they changed them this year, added a few new sections to fill out you see, I told (HIM) to chuck them out months ago! We can't use these. Sorry." Me: "Oh. Eh. Oops. That's not good." (Inside): "Noooooooo! I did it all for NOTHING?! I have been here for ages! Ugh! And I'm STARVING. I should be eating right now at home! Aggggh."" Oh the joys of working. Most of the time I've liked my job, but obviously it's not ever going to be all roses all the time. I haven't (thankfully) yet had a job where paperwork was exceedingly important to my OWN job description yet. ... It's only a matter of time... << >>
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Post by RandallBoggs on Oct 6, 2009 18:32:27 GMT -5
Randall of course doesn't drink. He doesn't like honestly working with a lack of thought being drunk, and even a small amount he would think would do so. It's like atheletes and steroids (some of them). Heck if Randall was an athelete (not too far), he wouldn't dare. Although he has plenty of bad experiences, doubt he'd waste money drinking. He may be naive, but he's not stupid. Huh...bottle under the desk.... Well you aren't the first to do Randall "drunk". Think that was Lil Bandit, and I'm pretty sure Randall didn't know as it was a "spike the punch" moment.
We'll see.
Actually Randall clocks in quite fast in his scare times and does it with little to no door shreds. In fact, some were a bit jealous or surprised he did it so fast.
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Post by pitbulllady on Oct 6, 2009 19:40:01 GMT -5
Randall of course doesn't drink. He doesn't like honestly working with a lack of thought being drunk, and even a small amount he would think would do so. It's like atheletes and steroids (some of them). Heck if Randall was an athelete (not too far), he wouldn't dare. Although he has plenty of bad experiences, doubt he'd waste money drinking. He may be naive, but he's not stupid. Huh...bottle under the desk.... Well you aren't the first to do Randall "drunk". Think that was Lil Bandit, and I'm pretty sure Randall didn't know as it was a "spike the punch" moment. We'll see. Actually Randall clocks in quite fast in his scare times and does it with little to no door shreds. In fact, some were a bit jealous or surprised he did it so fast. One of the reasons that Randall would probably avoid drinking, or at least, getting DRUNK(and you can consume moderate amounts of most "adult beverages" without getting drunk)would be to try and avoid another stereotype: the drunken Irish "mick". He probably knows, as I myself do all too well, that the widespread perception of people of Irish descent is that they are all stumbling drunkards spoiling for a fight 24/7. Also, with little or no body fat, Randall simply would not be able to handle alcohol the way someone like Waternoose(who is pretty chubby and stout) can, since people with higher fat-to-muscle ratios tend to metabolize alcohol much slower, meaning that its effect on them is far less noticeable. Randall probably has a high metabolism to compensate for his lack of insulating body covering like fur or feathers or blubber, to maintain his body heat(and yes, we all know he's NOT cold-blooded like a true reptile), so that means any alcohol or drug he consumed would hit him pretty fast and hard. That said, Randall's scare technique would seem, to me at least, to be the most effective and efficient, since it would largely rely on that deepest of fears: fear of the Unknown. With a monster like Sulley, HIS Scare ability would largely depend on a child's instinctive fear of large, aggressive predatory animals, that same fear that makes you feel a bit anxious when a leopard at the zoo fixes you in its cold stare or a large dog in a yard starts to growl and bark as you walk by. Since Randall can blend with any background, and assume this apparently innocuous appearance, he has that advantage of really messing with someone's head. Just imagine being in a room, all alone-or so you think. You feel secure and safe, and then from somewhere out of the darkness, you hear that low chuckle. It SEEMS to be coming from a plain wall, only there's nothing there...or IS there? There DOES seem to be something a bit "off" about that section of wall...it COULD be a trick of light, or your imagination...or does that look like teeth-razor-sharp teeth? And, is that YOUR own breathing you hear...or that of something else? While Sulley relies on his brute size, Randall relies on a much-deeper psychological aspect of fear. I can attest to how effective that is, having scared a high school football player into peeing himself at a cheap little Halloween "haunted house" put on by a school where I taught many years ago, simply by telling a ghost story(alleged to be true)...and, oh, having a parent volunteer dressed as a witch pop out of a darkened locker room at the right moment. I also was the victim of such a fear myself, many years ago. One of my wolf pack, a goofball Omega female, had dug out of her kennel and made a few rounds of the neighborhood, stealing sporting equipment. That's right-sporting equipment. Not killing kids or chickens or anything like that, but taking baseball mits, a deflated basketball, a plastic football tee, and a canister containing about 150 glow-in-the-dark golf balls. I did not know, at that time, that there WAS such a thing as glow-in-the-dark golf balls, honestly. It never occurred to me that some golfers were just that obsessive as to play in utter darkness, so when I arrived home at about 11 o'clock that night, not even knowing that this wolf had gotten out, and saw all these bright green things glowing there on my lawn, where there'd been no bright green glowing things the night before, I was, for several seconds, gripped by this most profound sense of FEAR I'd felt since Hurricane Hugo. I had no clue what they were; nothing even went through my mind as to what they were, but they were just so strange and so out-of-place that I was afraid to get out of my truck...over freakin' GOLF BALLS! It wasn't until my idiot wolf trotted out of the woods, picked up one of the glowing things and brought it to me like Lab with a dead duck that I at least realized that whatever the things were, they weren't dangerous, or she wouldn't have gone anywhere near them! This same wolf had been totally pwned by a kitten and a rabbit on two separate occasions, so she was very unlikely to have anything to do with something that might actually be a threat! I felt incredibly foolish for having been frozen with that fear of the Unknown...over what turned out to be a pile of golf balls, needless to say, but it brought home to me just how profound that fear can be, when you have absolutely no clue what is happening. pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Oct 6, 2009 19:46:59 GMT -5
I wouldn't know about consuming amounts...I never drink.
G...GOLF BALLS? Oh jeez...there's gotta be somewhere to post a story like that! ^0^
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Post by mentalguru on Oct 7, 2009 6:32:18 GMT -5
True. But I could SEE Randall perhaps eventually accepting a drink after Waternoose insisted a bit. And yeah, he would be kind of a 'light-weight' I feel. I'm not saying he got 'trashed' with Waternoose... more if would lower his inhibitions. And it wouldn't take much to do that.
Just because someone occasionally drinks alcohol doesn't mean he's 'stupid' RB. I take offense to that. I probably only drink... what once every two months even when I was at uni? And I don't drink much even at the time. Part of it is because I'M a lightweight and I was NEVER one of those kids who got off their asses at 15 anyway. I had my first drink about a month shy of my 18th birthday, the legal age because it was one of my friends 18th at the time. I've never really drunk that much either, and my friends now we're a little bit older aren't as 'into that' anymore anyway and neither am I. Went out last Saturday because I'm going away to England soon- had like one cider.
But special occasions- birthdays/engagements/new years/halloween/people leaving for a while etc etc. Well yeah.
I could see Waternoose convincing Randall to do this even if he at first refused. Just for a talk. And yeah, W would be a harder drinker. It doesn't necessarily have to happen under alcohol, him convincing Randall, but it would be interesting.
Do people still get sensitive about that in America PBL? People here (and down south) tend to think the idea as kind of a joke in some areas- there is some truth though I suposse (Dublin... oh boy, the stories, Belfast can be a bit wild too when it wants to be as well in that regard. So can Derry) but overall it's not taken that seriously because people are either laughed at because of it and they look kind of daft. It's just something silly people sometimescsee about Ireland (the whole island- hey I've got both scottish and Irish blood in me somewhere). Like leprauchans. And people who think we still live in huts with no electricity*, and are shocked SHOCKED to find out that isn't true.
(*I'm a tour guide... seriously, I see it sometimes with the less bright tourists from further afield... It's...bizarre. ^^;. Plus I've been told my accent sounds like someone trying REALLY hard to 'fake' an irish accent too once- I just laughed. Really hard. Other people say it's more like a mix of scottish and irish accents which... yeah is pretty much true. And makes sense too since it was the scottish who came over during the plantation in ulster rather than the english. Plus, we're CLOSER to Scotland, some parts of 'the north' or the bad part of Ireland according to Homer Simpson- people were mainly like -LOL, mentioned by the Simpsons!- for the most part when that happened.
Then there are people who think we are a WAR ZONE and there we are always utterly terrified to leave our homes all the time and there are bombers everywhere and that absolutely everyone who is in the Protestant or Catholic community hates each other. Um, no. THAT'S annoying. It's a kind of 'Only retards actually do those things. You really think I'm that retarded?' It's a bit more of a sensitive area for some.
Guess we just have different types of stereotyping to worry about in the end. People thinking we are all bombers is WAY worse than people thinking we all live in poverty or even that we are all heavy drinkers who skip around with leprauchans. Those ideas sound funny in comparison...
I mean it was funny for me at FIRST I guess. In a kind of 'You're not serious... are you?' But thinking people really think that about where I live is odd. In some ways it IS still a bit funny and we can still laught it off. But it can get old and it's more serious then the drinking thing.
Guess it depends on the person.
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