CrazyDiamond
Randall's Skivvy (0-299)
I'm shining!
Posts: 270
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Post by CrazyDiamond on Nov 5, 2013 18:56:24 GMT -5
You can download MU screenplay here: waltdisneystudiosawards.com/#/monsters-university/screenplayNot much about Randy (in terms of what we don't already know), but this line sums up his role in the whole movie: "With a pained smile - Randy’s thrilled to be a ROR, but isn’t exactly one of the guys - Randy camouflages. Pleased, Johnny chuckles."
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2013 20:26:01 GMT -5
Thanks for the link. I was hoping that the script might give some official insight as to whether or not Randy was kicked out (for example, maybe it would say something like "REVEAL JOHNNY and the RORs - although we notice that Randy is not among them"), but they don't even mention the fact that, for whatever reason, Randy is the only ROR member who isn't there. Oh well...
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Post by pitbulllady on Nov 5, 2013 20:36:18 GMT -5
You can download MU screenplay here: waltdisneystudiosawards.com/#/monsters-university/screenplayNot much about Randy (in terms of what we don't already know), but this line sums up his role in the whole movie: "With a pained smile - Randy’s thrilled to be a ROR, but isn’t exactly one of the guys - Randy camouflages. Pleased, Johnny chuckles."That's pretty much what the "Jr. Novelization" says, too. It specifically mentions Randall's "pained smile" when ordered to "do the thing". "Pained" does NOT suggest "happy", does it? It was very, very obvious that Randall was never "one of the guys"; he knew it, and THEY knew it, but he kept hoping that would change. It didn't. As for whether he actually was kicked out of ROR or not, I guess we will have to wait until 2015 to find out for sure, when Party Central precedes The Good Dinosaur. We know so far that the ROR's will be in it, so if Randall's not, we'll know that they kicked him out. That actually seems to tie in with the "Fear Book", in which we see that Johnny and the other ROR's signed it, and Johnny and Mike actually seemed on fairly good terms by that point, with Johnny joking about Mike being careful not to fall down a mail chute. It was obvious that at the time Johnny signed that, Mike and Sulley were already working at MI in the mail room, but conspicuously absent was Randall's signature or comment. I can't imagine that Mike would be any more "put out" with Randall than with Johnny, so if he and Johnny could put enough of their differences behind them that Mike would allow HIM to sign his "Fear Book", why not Randall, if he was there? Unless of course, Randall was too angry/hurt about Mike being friends with Sullivan, but I really have a feeling that we won't see Randall in Party Central. pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Nov 5, 2013 21:09:16 GMT -5
I've heard about Party Central, and to me, there's only two situations. Randall's in it or he's not.
If he isn't in it...that's correct. If he is, it's a fan service, and not really correct.
A firm fact is that Randall's primal fear was being humiliated and being a joke...and not ONLY did that HAPPEN, it was caused by the person who's been pushing him AND Wazowski for most of the start of his college life. Not ONLY did it happen...it happened in public, not just in public, but in front of the WHOLE student/teacher/professor body. Not only that, but in a competition where his performance mattered. And what happened in the end? He was humiliated, he came off as the worst (I've been meaning for a while now PBL, to correct you, but was hoping you'd notice, but Randall got the lowest score out of the RORs, not Reggie. Actually, in my re-glance, he got the lowest out of EVERYBODY (Wazowski's "real" score aside). But, as we all know, this score is faulty (call forward to Scare Board eh?), as his Scare was tampered with, and not a true measure of his abilities.) of his group....and he got NO support AT ALL from his fellow RORs. Given Johnny's reaction and his dismissive-ness of Sullivan earlier in the film (making him dropping Randall as form of call forward/back), Randall was pretty much out, either by Johnny or his own decision.
The RORs were just using him, and a part of him probably knew that. They were NOT good for him. If they have Randall in Party Central, it's like putting up that he's accepting "these guys who used him, didn't support him when he needed it most, and never really accepted him". It's an insult to Randall's stability and character. He's learned the, unfortunate, harsh lesson that some people just use you and don't really care one dang about you. Also, I can't recall at the moment, but isn't Party Central AFTER Sullivan and Wazowski are part of a scare team? If so, Randall's been a Scarer for awhile. So yeah, he would be in the same "visiting" situation as Wazowski and Sullivan...so would he visit the college where he'd had his self-esteem virtually almost destroyed? But depending on the time...would even some of the OKs still be in college? Wazowski and Sullivan had to work up the ladder through several jobs...and in-training period for MI Scarers is generally 2 years alone.
Granted...I would LIKE to see Randall just...come to the OKs. I WOULD like seeing him cut a rug and dance a bit and just have some fun. I would love to see that. At the time period...if Wazowski and Sullivan are a scare team (which would have taken years climbing up as they did)...Randall's been a scarer for a while (maybe even achieved his Top Scarer title by then). At this point he's better than he was, as he has the job, he's proving he's better than what was displayed back at MU, and things are stabilizing for him. There's no real reason he'd go back unless invited. If he was by the RORs, he'd probably tear up the letter because just doesn't want that hurtful part of his past, he's trying to move on.
Though...how the plot with the portal doors work is...confusing. Considering that they use a child's bedroom as the medium...that means...two closets...at least...but they're taking stuff from JOX AND ROR...so that's...three doors...all of which are kept in a security room...a room that Sullivan and Wazowski have a personal "been there, blew it up" moment as we all know...and somehow they have to get them into their rival frat houses.... .....that's...yeah confusing.
Anyway, to Randall. I would like to see him there, but rightfully, he's not. At the time period it is, he'd be trying to move on and try not to look back. Oh, small tibit. I did watch MU again...and yes, what Chet goes "your my hero", you can see Randall's ROR jacket (or sweater, or whatever) on the end of the wood seat there, laying flat. I may look again on HD sometime, but I did not see him in any of the crowd shots at all (and, as we know, he's not with the RORs when Sullivan "gives back" the trophy. A call back to the fact that Randall is ALWAYS with the ROR group).
So if Randall is somehow there, he's a free agent. He's not there for the RORs, but for some other reason. He's not going to stay in a fraternity (though they most likely kicked him out themselves) that continued to use him, partly frightened him, and fail to support him when he needed it most.
Oh, something I forgot to note...some review or another seemed to hint that the child or "couple" or whomever is the go-between for this strange room transport may be some sort of spoiler...so Randall may not be in it...but maybe there's some sort of nod to Boo (by her, or her parents).
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Post by pitbulllady on Nov 5, 2013 22:19:28 GMT -5
Actually, Party Central is supposed to take place BEFORE the end of that last semester at MU, before Johnny(who was a senior in MU)graduated, right after Mike and Sulley started work at MI as mail sorters. They were a long way from becoming a Scare team yet. The premise has Mike and Sulley going back to visit their OK brothers, who are throwing a party, only no one shows up, because the ROR's have thrown a huge end-of-school-year/graduation bash and that's where everyone is. Sheri Squibbles teaches the boys about something she calls "door jamming", which allows them to access the ROR's party via a rather round-about way, through the Human World and back, to literally bring everyone and everything at the ROR party to the OK house(I guess Mrs. Squibbles doesn't mind her own home being chock-full of drunk college frat boys). I'd always wondered about the fact that Johnny, Chet, Javier and Chip all signed Mike's freshman year "Fear Book", and there was nothing that indicated any hard feelings between them and Mike at that point. Like I said, Johnny even cuts up with him a bit, not in a mean way at all, although he still calls him "Killer"(could be worse, but in a way, that nickname is shockingly prophetic). I mean, once you get a Johnny Worthington nickname, you're stuck with it. Consider yourself lucky and be glad that he respects you enough to give you one. Those he doesn't care for at all just get called by their last names, i.e., "Boggs". Knowing that Mike and Sulley both got booted out of MU immediately following the Scare Games, I couldn't imagine when the ROR's would even have a chance to sign Mike's Fear Book, but if he and Sulley went back to visit just before graduation, that would explain that opportunity. Randall's signing, though, is absent. I can't see things between him and Mike already being so horrible by this point that either Mike would not let Randall sign the book(especially since Mike DID let Johnny sign it) or Randall would refuse to do so, IF he was there, so logically it would make sense that Randall just wasn't present.
I really don't think Randall will be in it, though, and I am almost hoping he won't. If he IS, like you said, RB, that will probably be just fan-service, and cheap fan-service at that, something I really do not expect from Pixar. If he IS in Party Central, either he's gonna be still in ROR and acting like nothing happened, OR he's going to be shown as angry, hateful, bitter and already plotting Sullivan's downfall, which wouldn't make sense. I can understand him being angry with Sulley, but not to the extent that he was in MI. I can understand why he'd vow not to LOSE to him again, if they ever would up in competition again. Given that both were freshmen, and Randall didn't know that Sulley would be kicked out of MU the following morning, nor had Randall been kicked out of ROR yet, Randall probably DID assume they'd compete again the following school year in the Scare Games. From Randall's perspective, Sulley beat him dishonestly and got by with it, so why WOULDN'T he be angry? Still, to show that this one event had already completely turned Randall into that same guy we saw in MI would not make sense at ALL. We all know what Randall was going through at MI and had been for years, and what that will do to anyone, so that is a far more logical explanation for his attitude in MI.
The thing that most of the haters don't get, though, is why that event so profoundly affected Randall, to the point that if ROR DIDN'T kick him out, he probably would have just left them anyway, and indeed, left MU altogether. Randall had a borderline phobia of failure, of being publicly humiliated and seen as a "joke" from the start. That's not a "primal fear", something instinctive. That was a LEARNED behavior, something that resulted from experience and conditioning, but you can tell that this is something that Randall obsesses over, worries about constantly, to the point that something as insignificant as an upside-down letter on a cupcake is like an "OMG" big deal to him. I mean, why should that matter, knowing that people are going to pick up the letters and eat them anyway, so pretty soon the whole phrase wouldn't make sense, but to Randall that was something completely unacceptable. While most of us, were we to experience what happened to him at the Scare Games, would eventually be able to push that to the back of our memories and move on, when that is piled on top of his already-exiting social anxiety and developing phobias, it was too much, triggering the phobias to become fully-developed and fed by now-existing PTSD, IF he didn't have that already when he came to MU. I cannot see Randall being able to show up at any party, any crowded event, at this point, this soon after that trauma.
pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Nov 5, 2013 23:21:00 GMT -5
Ah, alright, finally clear on that. I had thought, since I hadn't looked at Party Central in detail, that the "party" was for the (seemingly first?) Oozma Kappa members that became Scarers (or at least one did), which would be an occasion for the party. But alright, mail sorters it is.
Sheri knows this? And how the heck does SHE know this?? I can expect that kind of thing from Art (a mystery that's up there so far), but Ms. (or is it Mrs. now?) Squibbles?
Well remember now, Johnny DID win. Sullivan cheated (not Wazowski), and that was public made, so the RORs still won. He was SHOCKED he was so wrong on that fact (a fact that Hardscrabble agreed on). But when it came out...the hard feelings didn't go so hard. Johnny's a manipulator but...when he's right...it's really surprising when he learns he's wrong. He KNOWS Wazowski isn't a scarer (JUST LIKE Randall KNOWS he's better than Sullivan at it), and the fact that Wazowski, seemingly, has accepted that fact, he's out of "Johnny's court" as it were. So I understand the "settled ground" as it were. Heck, Randall was probably starting to get on settled ground with Sullivan before that whole "fall of the Top Scarer" and Scream Extractor business turned it's ugly head (which is why Randall still works so hard at his job even up to the end, because he KNOWS he's better than Sullivan, but everyone thinks otherwise. It's like he knows the sky is blue, but everybody is wearing colored glasses to fit in with popular people and they see otherwise. Not the best of examples, but you get what I'm saying).
Randall's...confused when it comes to Wazowski. I mean you see his look when he's looking over at the OKs and his "old friend" (or the person he tried to be friends with, and probably has respect for trying to go against Johnny) celebrating with the one who "intentionally" ruined and humiliated him. Wazowski he knows better than Sullivan, so that anger goes to him. As for Wazowski...he's unsure. He's too hurt and angry at the moment to figure things out, which is why him still being with the RORs is contrary with his character. You don't go into the frying pan and CHOOSE to stay in the frying pan. Him and Wazowski's cutting starts when Sullivan overtakes him as Top Scarer. Why? I'm still honing that down...but Randall, being on top and able to heal his self-esteem, would at least try to "rekindle" that friendship he tried to make, since by this time he'd be more leveled-out and confident to try better.
Exactly. I wouldn't MIND seeing Randall in the situations I said...but...it's not...so worth it if it demeans who he is and making him two-dimensional. Like ALL the others, there's MORE to him, and you just can't...cheapen that. We see Johnny throw Sullivan out, we see he targets the only one who supports Wazowski, we see he leads their actions, we see him offering a position back to Sullivan. Randall knows that he may have made a bad decision joining, but he was finally IN to something that may benefit for him, heck knows Wazowski wasn't helping him out (one-sided friendship). He later starts to see the difficulty...he had to be quiet and careful, listen to Johnny, push himself to perform, not to make mistakes. Pivotal as it was, the only mistake he seemed to have made for THEM was the performance at the final Scare Games (which wasn't even his fault), and they turn on him, not in support, but in retributive anger.
(You know, this just got me thinking. Here's another thought...it's out there, I don't so much believe it, but it just came to mind...what if Johnny thought Randall INTENTIONALLY blew the last game? To give Wazowski a better chance at winning? The two, at least to Johnny, were former friends. Of course, remember, afterward, nobody at all cared about the humiliation Randall went through and that it wasn't his fault. They were either laughing or angry, so why NOT think up some thought like the above.)
I'm guessing this comes from tumblr rants, most likely copy&pasted views on the same perspective. Anyway...the events of MU is what "helped" break his self-esteem and view on the world. He's healing from that point on. He doesn't really think about Sullivan unless he wants encouragement at a moment to try harder and push on. By the time he's at MI, and Top Scarer, he's in a better state of his life. When Sullivan comes back in, YEAH...he's still noted as that "cheater" and "jerk", since Randall wasn't around to see his change. He could ALSO be aware at that the RORs DID actually win and that Sullivan DID cheat even MORE (though Randall would probably be slightly unnerved that they highlight it being the tampered scare levels rather than the disruption with HIS scare. A little self-observant, but come on, you'd feel the same) than he thought. He could ALSO...be aware that somehow the two got in trouble with the law/CDA...considering it was in the paper (have to glance again, but considering the additional ads, it was the Horn), which he may have seen. BUT, Randall was a veteran scarer at the time, and the two were just starting. Presently showing, and knowing that he IS better than Sullivan (who probably didn't think too much of it), he was able to be better. The two (well, Randall) would have moved on from things had not...well....
A reason I stepped back. I am tired of hearing all this ridiculous bull. By primal, I meant it was one built into him, it's always there.
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Post by pitbulllady on Nov 6, 2013 0:14:57 GMT -5
You know, I have NEVER, ever even thought of that...that Johnny MIGHT have actually thought that Randall deliberately screwed up, just to give Mike's team an edge and help out his "friend"! Johnny obviously knew that Randall cared about Mike and still tried to think of him as a friend at the Scare Games sign-ups, because as soon as he caught Randall talking to Mike he immediately and loudly calls him over, taking him away from Mike once and for all. Johnny had observed Randall helping Mike study, noted the happiness on Randall's face to be doing that, so he KNEW that Mike meant something other than just a roommate or classmate. Johnny knew that Randall thought of Mike as a friend, even if that wasn't actually the case. It does make sense now that you mention it that Johnny might have actually thought that Randall's slip-up was intentional, at least on a subconscious level, to keep Mike from being humiliated. That could very well explain why Johnny got so p***ed at Randall, but not at Reggie, although Reggie just plain screwed up all on his own, with no help from his competitor. Yeah, Reggie definitely "took it easy on Grandpa", alright. It makes sense that Johnny was not yet fully convinced that Randall had totally abandoned Mike, and blamed Randall's loss to the fact that Randall had once looked up to Mike so much. THAT would be far more unforgivable than just screwing up or being inept, as Reggie did. I'm wondering, too, if Johnny thought that Randall's color scheme, coming out of the Scare Simulator, was intended as a joke or if he thought that Randall was intentionally trying to shame the ROR's by being "cute", perhaps as a sort of payback for what they did-and had HIM do-against the OK's. If Johnny thought that Randall was doing these things on purpose, that would constitute disloyalty to ROR and insubordination to HIM, which would have been legitimate grounds for dismissal from any fraternity...had that actually been the case. Sad thing is, I doubt that Randall would have bothered to plead his case and try to prove otherwise, but would have simply left without contesting those claims. I would love it if we get to see Johnny's reaction some day to finding out the truth, and especially if he could find out what really happened to Randall.
pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Nov 6, 2013 0:30:16 GMT -5
*chuckles* Yes, just came as a spare thought to me really...guess my step back didn't delude my thought process on the matter at hand heheh.
Yes, while Randall got the lowest score, it wasn't his fault as we all know. Reggie on the other hand has at least been with the RORs longer than Randall. I have researched too much into it, but we know Randall was a freshman, so if Reggie wasn't, he'd at least PARTICIPATED in a previous Scare Game...so if his slip up was common, he wouldn't still be in the fraternity. So for Johnny to take it all out on Randall (who himself had a worry expression when Reggie lost his bout, while Johnny gave a rather stern look I think. Actually, I should look again at all the RORs on that one...see IF Randall was the only one displaying an emotion other than anger/disappointment), it was more than just for a slip up.
The only real negative of Randall to Wazowski was the college prank. Natural application of Frats and their jokes aside...Randall had been doing as he was told and keeping his mouth shut every time with the RORs. In essence, he was obedient. But outside the prank (where he had no out), he never showed abrupt agreement with Johnny in relation to Wazowski. Every scene he has an unsure look. Heck, even in that group shot after the prank, he wasn't laughing or smiling, and the next moment, he's looking at Wazowski like...I dunno. (for the novelization, or no...Wazowski's own book...recall that in it...he actually confronts Randall about it and he goes "what am I suppose to say" or something along that lines, with the paragraph stating he was doing what frats did). So while he did as Johnny said, he never added more than the needed. Actually, at times, I think Randall was waiting for Wazowski to JUST acknowledge him. Maybe if Wazowski actually cared about him, things would have gone different. And that's care in EITHER way...care about Randall as a friend...or care that a "friend" was on the "enemy frat". Either way, no acknowledgement that would give Randall an "excuse" to speak up.
While I don't think Johnny, in the end, thought this...in the heat and desperation of the moment, it's still a possibility the thought ran through his mind. Randall probably wouldn't have. It was five against one, and any person with his disposition knows that if the odds are against you, even if you were right, your going to crash and burn. What happened to him was not his fault, that is fact, but nobody cared.
*taps temple* Actually...considering Johnny went to work for a rival scream plant...*grins* Don't you think it would be interesting for him to learn, after he graduated, that the "member he threw out"...worked up to become a Top Scarer? Kind of may be a jab to his view that Randall didn't have the material to be a scarer.
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Post by pitbulllady on Nov 6, 2013 1:13:09 GMT -5
I don't think that Johnny would be that bothered by Sulley becoming a Top Scarer; after all, Johnny DID acknowledge that he'd made a mistake in kicking Sulley out of ROR in the first place, even though honestly, it wasn't a mistake at all. ROR DID have standards, which all members, Johnny included, had to uphold, and those included a minimum GPA AND being a Scare major. By failing to maintain higher then a C average, and then getting himself kicked out of the Scare Program(not to mention setting off that Scream canister which missed Johnny's head by scant centimeters and darn near gave him a heart attack in front that entire freshman class), Sulley brought that all upon himself. Johnny had no choice there but to kick him out, since by keeping someone who was in clear violation of two the fraternity's main rules, Johnny would have himself been in violation and could have been stripped of his title, if not booted out himself. A fraternity is a national organization, after all, and the ROR chapter at MU was just one, and even Johnny had to answer to a national set of rules and leaders. With Randall, assuming that Johnny DID think Randall had deliberately botched his own Scare, there would still have been room for doubt, which Randall could have contested if he so chose(but we know he wouldn't), but with Sulley, it was a cut-and-dry case. Still, Johnny was willing to give him a second chance. But, for all his flaws, you can't say that Johnny isn't honest, that he'd support any illegal activity, and if he found out what Sulley and Mike did to Randall, I don't think he'd just let that slide.
That brings me to something else, though, not really relating to Randall. In the "interview" with Johnny, in the "school paper" article, which appears on the MU website, it's revealed that both his parents and his paternal grandfather worked at Monsters, Inc. as Scarers...but Johnny later works for Fear, Co. Pixar artists, along with Johnny's own voice actor, have repeatedly emphasized the strained relationship between him and his father, and basically blame John J. Worthington II, aka "John-John", for Johnny's attitude problem in MU. It's ironic that all three-Johnny, Randall and Sulley-are driven by a fear of failure and rejection. They just show it in different ways. Knowing of the pressure that John-John has placed on his son, I can't help but wonder WHY Johnny didn't follow in his footsteps and go to work for MI. It surely wasn't because they didn't need another superb Scarer. Either Johnny wound up living in whatever part of the country Fear, Co. is located in(MI definitely seems to be in the Midwest, perhaps analogous to Chicago, and is two hours from the campus of MU, according to the add for Harryhausen's in the Fear Book), maybe because he wound up marrying someone from that part of the country, or he just never really cared for the Midwest(he DOES have an upper-class New Orleans accent). There could have arisen some "bad blood" between the Worthingtons and the Waternooses(OH, would I love to see THAT)in the meantime, OR, just maybe, he finally realized that if he ever was going to be successful as an individual, he had to stop being an extension of his father and stick up for himself instead of just being what Daddy wanted him to be and treating everyone else the way Daddy treated HIM. Going to work for Fear Co. as opposed to MI might have been an act of defiance on his part.
pitbulllady
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Post by RandallBoggs on Nov 6, 2013 1:15:06 GMT -5
Just real quick, before I call it a day, I'll get the rest in a moment...I meant RANDALL as Top Scarer, not Sullivan. Randall was at the position before Sullivan was.
As for Johnny in relation to what the two did to Randall, I would agree. Johnny can be a great A-jerk...but I don't think he'd be all-right with what happened. Heck...think if THAT was a college prank...that would be the worst thing, not only illegal, but taking a joke way too far. Johnny would know the difference at least. Heck, he may have GOT some respect for Wazowski (hence the year book signing) about fessing up to the fact he's not a Scarer and moving ON with his life. If he learned what happened...that respect is poof, out the window.
An interesting three-step there, too, is how they all took to the job. Sullivan likely followed his father to be at MI...Johnny went against his father to be at Fear...and Randall...well his is unknown, he was doing it to fix himself. It WOULD be nice to see Johnny getting over such things, like Sullivan did, about living up to expectations. Though for Johnny, I think it was meeting those expectations, as set by his father. So if he went to Fear Co. to spite his father and strike his own path, good for him. But it is kind of unfortunate, of the three, Randall STILL gets the short end of the stick.
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